tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4717220359532645973.post3912006592076679880..comments2023-04-09T05:54:18.997-04:00Comments on Learning Complexity: Formalism in CCK11keith.hamonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08404376705918243534noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4717220359532645973.post-3416604952692528752011-03-04T21:41:01.975-05:002011-03-04T21:41:01.975-05:00DTRSmith, thanks for the comment. Like you, I too ...DTRSmith, thanks for the comment. Like you, I too "think it is fair to consider terms in discursive contexts." Indeed, that is part of the point I am trying to make about networks: all entities (including words such as <i>formal</i>) are parts of networks such as <i>discursive contexts</i>, and we cannot understand the entity without referencing the network within which it is couched. We cannot understand formal, even in a dictionary sense, unless we understand the context within which it is used. And as far as I can tell, each entity is itself a network. For instance, the individual word formal is a networked pattern of sounds, letters, usages, and meanings that functions and draws life from the larger networks within which it is used and interacts with other words.<br><br>At the end, you say that "only certain networks are open, flexible, robust, etc." I don't know of these closed networks, at least not in the sense that I am using the term network. I googled the phrase <i>closed networks</i> and discovered that it is used mostly to designate a "telecommunications network used for a specific purpose, such as a payment system, and to which access is restricted." I know a bit about networks, having built several in my professional career, and they all emerge from and are maintained by an incredibly rich ecosystem of electrical energy, manufactured devices, money, people, etc. Closed networks are closed only in a very narrow sense: that some people are given access while others are denied, and we all know numerous stories of supposedly closed networks being opened without permission. I suppose there are other communications networks (governmental, commercial, and religious) that try to remain closed, but those too seem all too vulnerable to breaching. Thus, as far as I know, closed networks are extremely rare, and even when they occur, they are seldom truly closed.<br><br>If I have misunderstood your point, please correct me. Or if I just don't know networks, then please provide me some examples. I'm a fairly open network always ready for learning.<br><br>And please find time to read Shirkey's article. It's worth it.keith.hamonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08404376705918243534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4717220359532645973.post-8727883088231066402011-03-04T10:35:59.430-05:002011-03-04T10:35:59.430-05:00To fall into the ontology trap, Selwyn is probably...To fall into the ontology trap, Selwyn is probably using Formal in, well, it's formal sense in traditional educational theory that often divides learning or education into formal (K-12/post-secondary), non-formal (training, non-institutional), and informal (personal, self-directed) learning. They are not extremely "clean" categories, as I am taking CCK11 as part of a University certificate program, as one example. I just think it is fair to consider terms in discursive contexts, which is not to say that your definition of formal isn't perfectly useful for talking about education.<br><br>Only certain networks are open, flexible, robust, etc. Connectivists and others may prefer these networks to other forms and I agree they are beneficial for some/many forms of learning. I don't agree with the groups/networks distinction, I think if you want to talk about certain kinds of networks, that is fine. I also think it is good to explore what kinds of networks work better in certain contexts and this is worthy of study and experimentation. I like a lot of what happens in CCK11, and most of my own learning in the last decade has come from blogs, user communities, etc. I have a technical, job, however, and these spaces are where the tech people provide the most timely information.<br><br>I think it is very difficult to talk about using network theory and analysis in Connectivism if you aren't going to apply it all types of networks.<br><br>I will have to delve into "Ontology is Overrated", I was intrigued by the title; but haven't had time yet.DTRSmithnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4717220359532645973.post-36350546241867223842011-02-10T21:39:53.274-05:002011-02-10T21:39:53.274-05:00Leah, I agree that hierarchical education does hav...Leah, I agree that hierarchical education does have some real energy that we shouldn't just dismiss. However, I still believe that network structures will come to dominate the educational landscape, just as hierarchical structures have for the past millennium. And we have to keep in mind that these are not absolutes, but rather points on a sliding scale. The same class can have elements of both and slide back and forth on the scale as needed.<br><br>Thanks for the comments.keith.hamonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08404376705918243534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4717220359532645973.post-35815388031318030082011-02-10T10:58:24.774-05:002011-02-10T10:58:24.774-05:00I was thinking about this in a similar way, not as...I was thinking about this in a similar way, not as astute as yours :), but in relation to our Elluminate sessions.<br><br>I think there's a big energy that happens when we log in to Elluminate and get to hear someone like Neil. That's a formal structure (teacher gets guest speaker on certain day and time, to talk about certain subjects) that operates as a network (no one is forced to be there, required to talk/type, etc.)--and I think it works. Although some of the technology issues (such as, I can't use a microphone) are annoying, I have found myself walking away from the sessions really thinking, really engaged.<br><br>That's a formal structure I wouldn't want to go away even in this relatively informal course.<br><br>Best,<br>Leahleahgrrlhttp://leahgrrl.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.com